The division I work for has been using powerlogic and pads2004 for years. Recently corp has mandated all sites shall convert to DxD and pads 2007.4. I would like to get a sense for what we will be contending with in the schematic, layout and libraries by changing to DxD and pads2007.4. The reason I ask is if there is a strong reason NOT to upgrade, then I would like to know before we change. As I recall the main differences between 2004 and 2005 are: added create pdf (powerlogic) rotate circuits (powerlogic) changed license requirement (powerlogic) added true type fonts (pads) changed VB structure (pads) changed key configurations (pads) changed menus (pads) fixed length matching (router) What would be gained and lost by changing from powerlogic2004 to DxD?
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What would be gained and lost by changing from pads2004 to pads2007? Bret -END- SupportNet: To unsubscribe send a blank email to: For assistance please send mail to The Hawker 17/2/2009, 16:48 น. On 2/17/2009 7:38 PM, Bret Adair wrote: The division I work for has been using powerlogic and pads2004 for years. Recently corp has mandated all sites shall convert to DxD and pads 2007.4.
I would like to get a sense for what we will be contending with in the schematic, layout and libraries by changing to DxD and pads2007.4. The reason I ask is if there is a strong reason NOT to upgrade, then I would like to know before we change. As I recall the main.differences between 2004 and 2005. are:.added create pdf (powerlogic) rotate circuits (powerlogic) changed license requirement (powerlogic) added true type fonts (pads).changed VB structure (pads) changed key configurations (pads) changed menus (pads) fixed length matching (router) What would be gained and lost by changing from powerlogic2004 to DxD? Way more overhead and pain to get a simple schematic out.
Loss of all your libraries. What would be gained and lost by changing from pads2004 to pads2007?
Loss of all your libraries and loss of backwards compatibility (PADS was forward and backward compatible libraries from V4 to 2004. That stopped after. Bret -END- SupportNet: To unsubscribe send a blank email to: For assistance please send mail to Hawker 17/2/2009, 16:48 น. For layout: If you're used to modifying the menufile to customize your menus, that will be out. There is supposed to be a hack to the registry to do some of the mods. Personally, I won't touch that.
You'll lose some VB function vs 2004. TT fonts can be nice, but there's some CAM problems with them. 2007 seems to be pretty stable, haven't really noticed too very many crashes, except on really large boards. I haven't used 2004 for quite a while, so I'm sure I'm forgetting something.
Can't say anything about DX, don't use it. JM - On Tue, 2/17/09, Bret Adair wrote: From: Bret Adair Subject: PADS latest and greatest? Sorry ahead of time, this likely to get ugly. To: 'Talk Mailing List' Date: Tuesday, February 17, 2009, 6:38 PM The division I work for has been using powerlogic and pads2004 for years. Recently corp has mandated all sites shall convert to DxD and pads 2007.4. I would like to get a sense for what we will be contending with in the schematic, layout and libraries by changing to DxD and pads2007.4. The reason I ask is if there is a strong reason NOT to upgradethen I would like to know before we change.
As I recall the main.differences between 2004 and 2005. are:.added create pdf (powerlogic) rotate circuits (powerlogic) changed license requirement (powerlogic) added true type fonts (pads).changed VB structure (pads) changed key configurations (pads) changed menus (pads) fixed length matching (router) What would be gained and lost by changing from powerlogic2004 to DxD? What would be gained and lost by changing from pads2004 to pads2007? Bret -END- SupportNet: To unsubscribe send a blank email to: For assistance please send mail to -END- SupportNet: To unsubscribe send a blank email to: For assistance please send mail to Bob Wilson 17/2/2009, 20:57 น.
There was no change to the VB structure. There WAS a change to the Macro structure. Therefore, if your VB scripts used calls to the old macro 'process commands', then they will need to be edited and some functionality may be lost for commands that aren't supported (at least until someone figures a work around). Also, any old macros will need to be re-written/recorded in the new structure. The code behind the menu structure was also changed, eliminating menufile.dat.
The biggest issue with that (if you customized it) is the lack of RMB customizations with the new method. There was also one other command (that I know of) that was overlooked with the new 'Customizations', 'Rotate Group 90'. This and possibly other commands can be accessed through Christian Friese's Keymapper program. He's the guy that created the base for many of the VB scripts that people know and love.
I trust his code and haven't had any issues with it at all. It's not a registry hack, anymore than Mentor's code to setup the customizations in the first place. There shouldn't be any loss of PADS Layout libraries either.
There is a converter provided that works fine. As far as migrating over to DxD from Logic, there is a significant learning curve with DxD, but you should be able to migrate your libraries. If not through some stand alone converter, you can translate your schematics to DxD then export/save the symbols to a library. It's been a while since I actually used DxD so I forget exactly how this is done That should be a top priority question to Corp.
There must be someone there that's made the switch, or they wouldn't care what tool your using. CT '$subst ('member.fullname')' wrote in message news:101588@talk. On 2/17/2009 7:38 PM, Bret Adair wrote: The division I work for has been using powerlogic and pads2004 for years. Recently corp has mandated all sites shall convert to DxD and pads 2007.4. I would like to get a sense for what we will be contending with in the schematic, layout and libraries by changing to DxD and pads2007.4.
The reason I ask is if there is a strong reason NOT to upgrade, then I would like to know before we change. As I recall the main.differences between 2004 and 2005. are:.added create pdf (powerlogic) rotate circuits (powerlogic) changed license requirement (powerlogic) added true type fonts (pads).changed VB structure (pads) changed key configurations (pads) changed menus (pads) fixed length matching (router) What would be gained and lost by changing from powerlogic2004 to DxD? Way more overhead and pain to get a simple schematic out. Loss of all your libraries.
What would be gained and lost by changing from pads2004 to pads2007? Loss of all your libraries and loss of backwards compatibility (PADS was forward and backward compatible libraries from V4 to 2004. That stopped after. Bret -END- SupportNet: To unsubscribe send a blank email to: For assistance please send mail to George Defond 18/2/2009, 5:19 น.
Jim: Great reference!! Bob Wilson: You hit most of the reasons I have chosen to stick with 2004 Spac2. The library is primo reason.
We sometimes use consultants who use version 5.x and 2004. Compatibility of libraries and transfer of attributes is important. It's how we drive our BOMs and assembly options. George Defond, PCB Designer David Clark Co. PO Box 15054 Worcester MA 01615 (508) 751-5800 x333 gdefond at davidclark dot com -Original Message- From: Jim Gazia mailto: Sent: Tuesday, February 17, 2009 7:54 PM To: Talk Mailing List Subject: RE: PADS latest and greatest?
Sorry ahead of time, this likely to get ugly.Original Message- From: Hawker mailto:@ Sent: Tuesday, February 17, 2009 5:48 PM To: Talk Mailing List Cc: Talk Mailing List Subject: Re: PADS latest and greatest? Sorry ahead of time, this likely to get ugly.
Jim Gazia 18/2/2009, 5:37 น. Years ago (more than I care to remember) I was told by the PADS (VAR) people that PowerLogic was going to die and you should make the transition to DXD. They were offering pretty good discounts on the product. So, I talked management into making the switch.
This was sometime around 2001-2002. So here we are & Logic2007 hasn't yet died. I talked to the guy who took my position when I left in 2004, and the engineers are still struggling with it. Some designs are still done in PowerLogic because well, they need to get done. I guess I can relate me leaving the company after switching them over to DXD like Janet Napolitano leaving Arizona after digging a $Billion+ Budget Deficit.
DXD is not very intuitive. That's an understatement. You can't do anything without a manual or Tech Support. Put SupportNet on Speed Dial. Oh wait.do they still take phone calls? You will continue to use Logic200x for designs you need done this year as you swim through the rapids of DXD. If you're just using it for schematic.bad move!
You might want to get Mentor to throw in free training.like a month's worth or actually put someone on site so you don't go bankrupt before you figure the package out. I do however HIGHLY RECOMMEND getting DX Databook. It was definitely the silver lining to a tarnished business decision. Did I say I highly recommend getting DxDatabook?
-JAG John Matthews 18/2/2009, 6:42 น. You can ASCII-out to older versions, with some exception. Like if you use a function not in the older version. Longer signal names, longer designators, things like that. You'll get warnings about split/mixed planes if you go back to some versions, but the board will still ASCII-out.
If you use TT Fonts, you will get a warning, but they're supposed to revert to the PADS Stroke font. The VB scripts I've seen quit are ones like the view toolbar, also one we had at SHD that created multi-line text items.
Tere were some that would lock up the editor (or just cause weirdness), and, as of v2007, any that modded or hacked the menufile to perform their function. There have been some scripts that replace some of the messed-up ones. I'm being vague because, outside of a couple that I used a lot, I can't remember some of the others. I remember folks griping on here about this or that script not working anymore though. TT fonts have a bad habit (as you learned) of dropping letters, being filled in (aka blobs instead of characters) - bold, symbol, or outline type fonts are the worst about filling in. Using TT fonts will also sometimes split positive planes (and even some non-plane layers) up into two and three Gerber layers, a real PITA.
Seems Mentor likes to add these 'cool' new functions, but then never bothers to fix the glitches and problems. JM Bob Wilson wrote. Wilson - On Tue, 2/17/09, John Matthews wrote: From: John Matthews Subject: Re: PADS latest and greatest? Sorry ahead of time, this likely to get ugly. To: 'Talk Mailing List' Date: Tuesday, February 17, 2009, 8:22 PM For layout: If you're used to modifying the menufile to customize your menus, that will be out.
There is supposed to be a hack to the registry to do some of the mods. Personally, I won't touch that. You'll lose some VB function vs 2004. TT fonts can be nice, but there's some CAM problems with them. 2007 seems to be pretty stable, haven't really noticed too very many crashes, except on really large boards. I haven't used 2004 for quite a while, so I'm sure I'm forgetting something.
Can't say anything about DX, don't use it. JM - On Tue, 2/17/09, Bret Adair wrote: From: Bret Adair Subject: PADS latest and greatest? Sorry ahead of time, this likely to get ugly. To: 'Talk Mailing List' Date: Tuesday, February 17, 2009, 6:38 PM The division I work for has been using powerlogic and pads2004 for years.
Recently corp has mandated all sites shall convert to DxD and pads 2007.4. I would like to get a sense for what we will be contending with in the schematic, layout and libraries by changing to DxD and pads2007.4. The reason I ask is if there is a strong reason NOT to upgradethen I would like to know before we change. As I recall the main.differences between 2004 and 2005.
are:.added create pdf (powerlogic) rotate circuits (powerlogic) changed license requirement (powerlogic) added true type fonts (pads).changed VB structure (pads) changed key configurations (pads) changed menus (pads) fixed length matching (router) What would be gained and lost by changing from powerlogic2004 to DxD? What would be gained and lost by changing from pads2004 to pads2007? Bret -END- SupportNet: To unsubscribe send a blank email to: For assistance please send mail to -END- SupportNet: To unsubscribe send a blank email to: For assistance please send mail to -END- SupportNet: To unsubscribe send a blank email to: For assistance please send mail to - John Matthews Silicon Hills Design 8504 Cross Park Drive Austin, Texas 78754 512.836.1088 x1108 -END- SupportNet: To unsubscribe send a blank email to: For assistance please send mail to Chuck Tidwell 18/2/2009, 7:53 น.
Actually many/most of the process commands still work when called from a VB script. For instance you just need to keep the Display Colors. Window open for display related commands to work and the Filter window must be open for filter related commands to work. There are a few that don't work regardless and need to be edited and I think there are some others that still work without issue.
The missing menufile.dat the biggest impediment to old VB scripts. Mainly because a lot of them use CF's FunctionKeys.bas file which does a temp mod to menufile.dat, but its gone in newer versions of PADS. My Multi-Line text script is also broken because of the TT fonts but I'm sure I could fix it if needed.
I just never use it, so I haven't taken the time. CT '$subst ('member.fullname')' wrote in message news:101592@talk. On 2/17/2009 7:38 PM, Bret Adair wrote: The division I work for has been using powerlogic and pads2004 for years.
Recently corp has mandated all sites shall convert to DxD and pads 2007.4. I would like to get a sense for what we will be contending with in the schematic, layout and libraries by changing to DxD and pads2007.4. The reason I ask is if there is a strong reason NOT to upgrade, then I would like to know before we change. As I recall the main.differences between 2004 and 2005. are:.added create pdf (powerlogic) rotate circuits (powerlogic) changed license requirement (powerlogic) added true type fonts (pads).changed VB structure (pads) changed key configurations (pads) changed menus (pads) fixed length matching (router) What would be gained and lost by changing from powerlogic2004 to DxD? Way more overhead and pain to get a simple schematic out. Loss of all your libraries.
What would be gained and lost by changing from pads2004 to pads2007? Loss of all your libraries and loss of backwards compatibility (PADS was forward and backward compatible libraries from V4 to 2004. That stopped after. Bret -END- SupportNet: To unsubscribe send a blank email to: For assistance please send mail to Jason Roetz 18/2/2009, 8:35 น. Count me in on that. I used that one quite a bit before Mentor broke whatever allowed it to work. JM Jason Roetz wrote: Any clue if the Pin Net to Silk (I think that's the name) macro can be fixed to run under 2007?
This is one I really miss. Regards, Jason -Original Message- From: Chuck Tidwell' Sent: Wednesday, February 18, 2009 9:53 AM To: Talk Mailing List Subject: Re: PADS latest and greatest?
Sorry ahead of time, this likely to get ugly. Actually many/most of the process commands still work when called from a VB script.
For instance you just need to keep the Display Colors. Window open for display related commands to work and the Filter window must be open for filter related commands to work. There are a few that don't work regardless and need to be edited and I think there are some others that still work without issue. The missing menufile.dat the biggest impediment to old VB scripts. Mainly because a lot of them use CF's FunctionKeys.bas file which does a temp mod to menufile.dat, but its gone in newer versions of PADS. My Multi-Line text script is also broken because of the TT fonts but I'm sure I could fix it if needed. I just never use it, so I haven't taken the time.
CT '$subst ('member.fullname')' wrote in message. CT '$subst ('member.fullname')' wrote in - John Matthews Silicon Hills Design 8504 Cross Park Drive Austin, Texas 78754 512.836.1088 x1108 -END- SupportNet: To unsubscribe send a blank email to: For assistance please send mail to Bret Adair 18/2/2009, 9:00 น. So which is the 'high-end' product? Logic or DxD??? R '$subst ('member.fullname')' wrote in message news:101614@talk. Design Rules HTH, Jason Bret JM Cliff Harris wrote: For assistance please send mail to - John Matthews Silicon Hills Design 8504 Cross Park Drive Austin, Texas 78754 512.836.1088 x1108 -END- SupportNet: To unsubscribe send a blank email to: For assistance please send mail to -END- SupportNet: To unsubscribe send a blank email to: For assistance please send mail to -END- SupportNet: To unsubscribe send a blank email to: For assistance please send mail to Jason Roetz 18/2/2009, 10:19 น.
Hi JimDXD is not very intuitive. That's an understatement. I find it very intuitive. You must have come from using OrCAD.which IMO is the least intuitive (and most infuriating) CAD program I've ever used. You can't do anything without a manual or Tech Support. I've been using DxD/ViewDraw since pre-1990 and I've never opened a manual, and I haven't called tech support in probably 12+ years (and when I did, it had to do with Xilinx libraries, not ViewDraw functionality/use).
So, I don't know what problems you're having.but if you're trying to fit a square peg (previous OrCAD user) into a round hole (now trying to use DxD), I understand. OrCAD users seem confounded with trying to use other schematic programs.and being an OrCAD user, I understand why. Regards, Austin -END- SupportNet: To unsubscribe send a blank email to: For assistance please send mail to [email protected] 19/2/2009, 7:43 น. Austin, Wow, I was waiting to see your response, I was wondering if you were OK.:-) There is a “3rdparty.txt” file attached, I received this from a customer who need to feed Allegro. I was wondering if you had any docs or knowledge about the data in the $PACKAGES section.
Thanks, Bob Kondner -Original Message- From: Austin Franklin mailto: Sent: Wednesday, February 18, 2009 10:40 PM To: Talk Mailing List Subject: RE: PADS latest and greatest? Sorry ahead of time, this likely to get ugly. Hi JimDXD is not very intuitive. That's an understatement. I find it very intuitive. You must have come from using OrCAD.which IMO is the least intuitive (and most infuriating) CAD program I've ever used.
You can't do anything without a manual or Tech Support. I've been using DxD/ViewDraw since pre-1990 and I've never opened a manual, and I haven't called tech support in probably 12+ years (and when I did, it had to do with Xilinx libraries, not ViewDraw functionality/use). So, I don't know what problems you're having.but if you're trying to fit a square peg (previous OrCAD user) into a round hole (now trying to use DxD), I understand. OrCAD users seem confounded with trying to use other schematic programs.and being an OrCAD user, I understand why. Regards, Austin -END- SupportNet: To unsubscribe send a blank email to: For assistance please send mail to -END- SupportNet: To unsubscribe send a blank email to: For assistance please send mail to Austin Franklin 19/2/2009, 9:30 น.
Austin, Wow, I was waiting to see your response, I was wondering if you were OK.:-) There is a “3rdparty.txt” file attached, I received this from a customer who need to feed Allegro. I was wondering if you had any docs or knowledge about the data in the $PACKAGES section. Thanks, Bob Kondner -Original Message- From: Austin Franklin mailto: Sent: Wednesday, February 18, 2009 10:40 PM To: Talk Mailing List Subject: RE: PADS latest and greatest? Sorry ahead of time, this likely to get ugly. Hi JimDXD is not very intuitive.
That's an understatement. I find it very intuitive. You must have come from using OrCAD.which IMO is the least intuitive (and most infuriating) CAD program I've ever used. You can't do anything without a manual or Tech Support.
I've been using DxD/ViewDraw since pre-1990 and I've never opened a manual, and I haven't called tech support in probably 12+ years (and when I did, it had to do with Xilinx libraries, not ViewDraw functionality/use). So, I don't know what problems you're having.but if you're trying to fit a square peg (previous OrCAD user) into a round hole (now trying to use DxD), I understand. OrCAD users seem confounded with trying to use other schematic programs.and being an OrCAD user, I understand why. Regards, Austin -END- SupportNet: To unsubscribe send a blank email to: For assistance please send mail to -END- SupportNet: To unsubscribe send a blank email to: For assistance please send mail to -END- SupportNet: To unsubscribe send a blank email to: For assistance please send mail to Robert Kondner 19/2/2009, 9:53 น. Hi, Yes, AAPCB wanted be to give a talk about doing prototypes if I recall my abstract correctly. I need to find out when I am scheduled to talk then I can make some plans.
I will let you know. Looking forward to learn how to spell Allegro.
We have a group of processors and grad students at UCB (Berkeley) that is using AAPCB for assembly. They want to organize their data and feed Allegro from various schematic tools. Plus, they want a “Cooperative” library system. What is a low end Allegro system called these days and do you know the approx. Thanks, Bob Kondner.
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